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#1 rr762mmfmj

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Posted 17 December 2007 - 09:39 PM

OK, please un-confuse me. I am under the impression that any high capacity mag built prior to the ban is legal to own and use in CA. So, how do I tell if the mag is pre-ban? I have access to a couple of 30 round AR15 mags that were discarded by the military in the 80's.Thanks

#2 homemade

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Posted 17 December 2007 - 09:50 PM

There is no way to tell a preban from a post ban magazine they are not dated.Just dont ever get caught with any.

#3 Red Dog

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Posted 17 December 2007 - 09:53 PM

LOL, Didn't you say you know what your doing? Sorry, just had to say it. The way I understand it is that if you owned it before the ban it is ok to use it. I do believe they date stamp some of these.

#4 Braz

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Posted 17 December 2007 - 10:02 PM

For what it's worth, talking about this kind of thing, and saying you bought such and such, just isn't too smart. Don't you realize that there are people that monitor these kinds of sites, and you may be putting yourself in harms way? The smart thing is to never say anything on the internet that you would not be willing to say directly to the authorities. If it were my post, I would be tempted to edit it. Just my opinion.
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#5 A17Shooter

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Posted 17 December 2007 - 11:50 PM

Good point. There is no privacy on the open Internet.

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#6 OrneryOlMofo357

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Posted 18 December 2007 - 05:10 AM

For my way of thinking, as long as I live in Commiefornia, its not worth it to me to keep questionable firearm parts like Hi Cap mags..I'd love one for my Mini..but, one over zealous Barney Fyfe type of cop could make life miserable.. Im gonna wait till I get to a " Free" State! lol
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#7 rr762mmfmj

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Posted 18 December 2007 - 06:55 AM

LOL, Didn't you say you know what your doing? Sorry, just had to say it. The way I understand it is that if you owned it before the ban it is ok to use it. I do believe they date stamp some of these.

I know what I'm doing after I educate myself :rofl2:

#8 rr762mmfmj

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Posted 18 December 2007 - 07:05 AM

I don't have the magazines, I am attempting to gain information as to the legality of acquiring them. They were offered to me, in another state, I said "no thanks, not until I find out if it is legal for me to own in CA"Anyone can monitor my posts, I have not a single item that is illegal or unregistered, it isn't worth it. If it's OK to have them I may have them sent. I am more interested in the convenience of carry, my rifle carries 2-10 round magazines in the stock or 1-30 round magazine. Anyone here that has read my post's know I am about the one single accurate shot and have made fun of the rapid fire guys. So, back on track here, does anyone know where I can gain the information I need?Thanks

#9 gbp

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Posted 18 December 2007 - 08:19 AM

I had three 30 round mags but ended up taking a hammer to them after my son was charged with three felonies for posession. The DA finally told the PD to return them to me but it's just not worth the hassel
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#10 nevjohn

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Posted 18 December 2007 - 08:27 AM

When I moved back to "the Motherland" afew months ago, I sold my Hi-Cap XD mags (5) on Craigslist to another guy back in NV, and then bought the Legal 10 rounders, just to keep legal. I dont know what 2 rounds would make a difference, but according to CDOJ it does. Course, I can carry as many magazines on my hip as I want. Dont make sense, does it??
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#11 Camoghost

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Posted 18 December 2007 - 08:43 AM

For the record, I own a sling shot..

#12 D-Man

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Posted 18 December 2007 - 08:52 AM

For the record, I own a sling shot..

Just don't shoot it here in La Verne as that is against the regs here. Sold my sling shot so that I wouldn't get charged ;)Darren
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#13 Quade

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Posted 18 December 2007 - 09:27 AM

For the record, I own a sling shot..

And I own a assault rock... :roflmao3[1]:

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#14 D-Man

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Posted 18 December 2007 - 10:39 AM

I remember that being listed on EBay. Sold for a lot of money as well!Darren
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#15 4RHUNTS

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Posted 18 December 2007 - 12:08 PM

Ok, if you owned the high cap mags before the ban it is ok to keep/use them. If you aquire them in any way after that it is illegal to have them. You can not bring them into Calif. from someplace else. Many of the post ban high cap mags are marked from the manfacturer as for law enforcement or military use only.

#16 homemade

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Posted 18 December 2007 - 01:39 PM

As far as I know if you can "PROVE" its preban its legal but I know around here barney fifes assume its illegal and its up to you to "PROVE" its legal and then if you do its still hell getting them to give it back to you.

#17 rr762mmfmj

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Posted 18 December 2007 - 03:16 PM

OK then its a done deal, I told them to throw them in the trash. I don't need them bad enough to have to prove that I am not breaking the law. Thanks for the input.

#18 Fjold

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Posted 18 December 2007 - 08:00 PM

CA Penal Code says it is illegal to:12020. (2) Commencing January 1, 2000, manufactures or causes to be manufactured, imports into the state, keeps for sale, or offers or exposes for sale, or who gives, or lends, any large-capacity magazine.It is not against the law to own them.Read strictly by the letter of the law there is nothing illegal about finding normal (high) capacity magazines in the trash and keeping them.
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#19 Shoot-it

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Posted 18 December 2007 - 09:24 PM

And I own a assault rock... :harhar1[1]:

Is that the glock rock . i think they are banned to lol

#20 4RHUNTS

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Posted 19 December 2007 - 11:17 AM

As far as I know if you can "PROVE" its preban its legal but I know around here barney fifes assume its illegal and its up to you to "PROVE" its legal and then if you do its still hell getting them to give it back to you.

You guys kill me sometimes. Do you only refer to us LEO's, (there a a few that are CPC members), as "Barney Fifes" when YOU need a cop, or only when they are doing thier job upholding the laws of this state which you may not agree with? We just enforce the laws as enacted by people elected by who.... Us who vote.

#21 ReconDoc242

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Posted 19 December 2007 - 01:42 PM

Well said dude. LEOs have a hard and sometimes unpopular job to do. Disrespecting someone for doing his job isn't cool. I truly believe that the majority of LEOs do not agree with the gun laws in this state. When they enforce them, they are just doing their job.
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#22 homemade

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Posted 23 December 2007 - 11:09 AM

I dont have a problem with law enforcment.Most of my gunsmith customers are law enforcment.But its like anything else it takes one bad apple to make the rest look bad in the publics eye.

#23 jim d

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Posted 23 December 2007 - 12:08 PM

Being as how I have worked in gun shops and sold guns and talked to numerous LEO's, Agents for ATF & DOJ I fully believe that the real problem is in the way that the laws are written. You need to have a degree in law to be able to understand the laws.--jim d

#24 lilwes278

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Posted 23 December 2007 - 12:37 PM

You guys kill me sometimes. Do you only refer to us LEO's, (there a a few that are CPC members), as "Barney Fifes" when YOU need a cop, or only when they are doing thier job upholding the laws of this state which you may not agree with? We just enforce the laws as enacted by people elected by who.... Us who vote.

Unfortunately, almost every single encounter I've had with an officer, they've had a real bad attitude and the problem was either not taken care of or worsened on my end. The problem is there are SO MANY "bad apple" cops, that the "good apples" seem to be the minority. The laws have too many grey areas that the LEO's can twist around in any way that best suits them and many times when they take inappropriate actions, it is simply excused because "they were just doing their job". LEO's are nothing more than human beings doing a job, they are no more or less important than a janitor or a CEO. The difference is if the janitor or CEO slips up, they are held accountable. Yes, LEO's "lay their lives on the line" everyday, but so do a whole lot of other workers only they don't get the pay & benefits to compensate for it. Many officers see themselves as elitists but need to realize they are just the same as every other law abiding citizen. Their job is "To protect and to SERVE"!!!To any LEO's on this board, if you follow the laws and respect your job, congratulations and this shouldn't offend you. But if you are offended by it, maybe you need to take a step back and reconsider your attitude & actions. It's only a job & a shiny piece of metal on your chest. It does not make you better than everyone else, it does not mean the laws do not apply to you, it does not make you the judge, jury, & exectutioner, and it does not give you a free pass to treat people like dog poop.
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#25 Fjold

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Posted 23 December 2007 - 05:21 PM

As far as I know if you can "PROVE" its preban its legal but I know around here barney fifes assume its illegal and its up to you to "PROVE" its legal and then if you do its still hell getting them to give it back to you.

100% wrongThe burden of proof is on the State to prove that you sold, imported, manufactured or borrowed the magazines after 1 Jan, 2000.Read the law, it is not illegal to own them, find them or buy them.
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#26 4RHUNTS

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Posted 23 December 2007 - 06:46 PM

I dont have a problem with law enforcment.Most of my gunsmith customers are law enforcment.But its like anything else it takes one bad apple to make the rest look bad in the publics eye.

I agree with you on the "bad apple" concept that makes everyone look bad. Thats why I took exception to your blanket statement about the "Barney Fifes" as if they all were bad apples. I've known several "bad apples" in my years as an LEO. Believe me the rest of us dislike them as much as the citizens we serve. But the majority of them are very hard working men and women who have chosen a difficult profession. Thanks for clearing up your post.

#27 4RHUNTS

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Posted 23 December 2007 - 08:05 PM

Unfortunately, almost every single encounter I've had with an officer, they've had a real bad attitude and the problem was either not taken care of or worsened on my end. The problem is there are SO MANY "bad apple" cops, that the "good apples" seem to be the minority. The laws have too many grey areas that the LEO's can twist around in any way that best suits them and many times when they take inappropriate actions, it is simply excused because "they were just doing their job". LEO's are nothing more than human beings doing a job, they are no more or less important than a janitor or a CEO. The difference is if the janitor or CEO slips up, they are held accountable. Yes, LEO's "lay their lives on the line" everyday, but so do a whole lot of other workers only they don't get the pay & benefits to compensate for it. Many officers see themselves as elitists but need to realize they are just the same as every other law abiding citizen. Their job is "To protect and to SERVE"!!!To any LEO's on this board, if you follow the laws and respect your job, congratulations and this shouldn't offend you. But if you are offended by it, maybe you need to take a step back and reconsider your attitude & actions. It's only a job & a shiny piece of metal on your chest. It does not make you better than everyone else, it does not mean the laws do not apply to you, it does not make you the judge, jury, & exectutioner, and it does not give you a free pass to treat people like dog poop.

'lilwes,I truly believe that if you treat others the way you would want to be treated in a given set of circumstances it will go a long way. And if "almost every single encounter" I had with an LEO turned out bad, I would probably loose faith in them too. The "good apples" are not the minority. I for one hate the "bad apples" because when they have treated somebody badly that person is most likely going to hold that against the next LEO they encounter no matter how they are treated. So, that being said, if somebody starts giving me a bad time when I started out being polite, guess what? That grey area that may have allowed me to not write a ticket or make an arrest, just got black and white. Our system of law enforcement is based on the "Spirit of the Law" vs. the "Letter of the Law" which gives the officer discretion to weigh as to what is served best, the interest of the community as a whole, or what is in the best interest of the people involved. I do not think any of us would like a total "Letter of the Law" type of law enforcement. As a LEO I sure wouldn't. That would mean for every violation no matter how minor or petty, I would be required to take official action. And it is not "only a job & shiny piece of metal on your chest". Most of us take great pride in doing a job others won't or simply can't do. A person must go through a very difficult testing process that will hopefully weed out the "bad apples". These include a written test, agility test, background, psych, medical, polygraph and more. But nothing is perfect and they, "bad apples", do get through. And we are held accountable for our actions. If somebody is treated badly by an LEO, that person should follow up with a complaint to that LEO's dept. If that does not work contact the City Council or County Board of Supervisors. If valid complaints are made guess what? Maybe we do have a "bad apple" here. But we are human and we will make mistakes, just like the janitor or CEO.In closing, I would think that if almost every encounter I had with an LEO turned out negative, I just might take a good hard look at how I represented myself during those encounters, and evaluate if my actions may have contributed to the LEO to view me, the citizen, as a "bad apple". Thank goodness there are more 'good apples" than "bad apples" in every bunch. For all the "bad apples" out there in law enforcement, I apologize. Ok, now I am off my soap box. I encourage each and every one of you to go out and ride with a LEO in your area if you have the time. Not one who is a friend of yours because that could slant opinions/perceptions. If it is a slow shift you will think they get paid for that? If it is a busy one with eyes wide open, and a very elevated heart rate, you will think they don't get paid enough!! I still love it after 25+ years. Just my 2 cents.

#28 lilwes278

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Posted 23 December 2007 - 08:26 PM

If somebody is treated badly by an LEO, that person should follow up with a complaint to that LEO's dept. If that does not work contact the City Council or County Board of Supervisors. If valid complaints are made guess what? Maybe we do have a "bad apple" here.

I did try to file a complaint. It was the officer's supervisor that told me "this isn't TV, we don't have to read you your rights". When I tried to contact the chief to complain about the supervisor, I was told they would file harassment charges against me if I didn't let it drop. How's that for a "bad apple"? Instead, I fought the charges over the time span of one year, finally went to trail, and within exactly 27 minutes of closing arguements (it was THAT obvious) the jury decided I was innocent and the officer was wrong to arrest me. There's much more to the story than that, and I have several other stories to go along with it (including an encounter with a certain forest ranger that I went to court for and won). I'm going to refrain from posting them here because I'm sure not everyone wants to hear them. If anyone does want to hear them, or thinks I'm blowing things out of proportion, I'll be happy to explain further in PM's.
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#29 300wsm

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Posted 23 December 2007 - 08:55 PM

You guys kill me sometimes. Do you only refer to us LEO's, (there a a few that are CPC members), as "Barney Fifes" when YOU need a cop, or only when they are doing thier job upholding the laws of this state which you may not agree with? We just enforce the laws as enacted by people elected by who.... Us who vote.

If you LEO's are so concerened with upholding the law, why arn't you deporting the illegal Mexicans, seems the LEO's pick and choose the laws you want to enforce. Deporting illegals costs money,busting tax paying americans makes you money.That is the bottom line.,,300wsm

#30 4RHUNTS

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Posted 23 December 2007 - 09:33 PM

I did try to file a complaint. It was the officer's supervisor that told me "this isn't TV, we don't have to read you your rights". When I tried to contact the chief to complain about the supervisor, I was told they would file harassment charges against me if I didn't let it drop. How's that for a "bad apple"? Instead, I fought the charges over the time span of one year, finally went to trail, and within exactly 27 minutes of closing arguements (it was THAT obvious) the jury decided I was innocent and the officer was wrong to arrest me. There's much more to the story than that, and I have several other stories to go along with it (including an encounter with a certain forest ranger that I went to court for and won). I'm going to refrain from posting them here because I'm sure not everyone wants to hear them. If anyone does want to hear them, or thinks I'm blowing things out of proportion, I'll be happy to explain further in PM's.

Sounds like it was a good thing for you that the Officer or the Forest Ranger were not the "Judge, Jury or Executioner", or else you surely would not have prevailed in those two cases. I am glad to hear a Jury of your peers did their civic duty. I have one question though...was it a "bad apple" District Attorney who filed the criminal complaint after the arrest? I am sure they have "bad apples" too. You see the Police need Probable Cause to make an arrest, meaning given a set of circumstances and/or evidence known to the officer, and based on his training and experience it is probable that the person committed a crime, giving the Officer the Probable Cause to make an arrest. After the arrest, the case goes to the District Attorney's office for filing of a criminal complaint where the DA reviews the case and decides to file or not. I would hope if an illegal arrest was made, one without Probable Cause, civil remedies were sought.As far as trying to complain to the Chief and being threatened, I would then contact the City Council and complain about the Chief, after all, the Chief does work for them. And as we all know....there are some really "bad apples" on those City Councils. See, they are everywhere !!!!!




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