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#1 CBR400RR

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Posted 01 November 2012 - 09:42 AM

Looking for opinions on this scope for target shooting Hawke Sidewinder 30 Scope IR 8-32x56 Mil Dot IR

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#2 Brant

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Posted 16 March 2013 - 05:26 PM

Did you ever buy this scope? I was considering one for my Cricket.



#3 CBR400RR

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Posted 16 March 2013 - 10:44 PM

No I got  Nikko Target master 6-24X56 Mil Dot but I'm going to get the Hawk 8-32X56 Mil Dot for my next scope probably unless they come out with a better one. 



#4 docskinner

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Posted 16 March 2013 - 10:45 PM

Is it designed for air rifles? different dynamics and all. And the crickets look cool - but are they 500yard+ guns? 32x? seriously? 9x is a ton of magnification under 100 yards. If you can print patterns with that under 100 yards, more scope is not going to help. 



#5 Brant

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Posted 17 March 2013 - 06:07 AM

Sounds like your interested in adult airguns. :-) They are way cool for hunting or target shooting with vast improvements in the technologies. Yes the scopes are designed somewhat for airguns too and focus down to ten yards among other differences (side focus for precise ranging is required). I dont shoot Field Target in competition but take advantage of their scopes for precise pesting fun. That said guys do shoot cast slugs in airguns out to maybe 300 yards regularly but the high mag for Field Target shooting is normally 100 yards and down. More mag always helps even if it is to a lessor degree than at 100s of yards. We sometimes shoot at flies that land on a white target at 50 yards. These guns are that accurate but tend to run in the $2k range plus $500-1000 or so for a good scope. I see Field Target scopes run to 50-60x. You can count whiskers. On the other end of the spectrum there are big bore airguns (like 50 cal) and all north American game has been taken humanely with a big bore airgun.

 

Hawke even distributes excellent free software for airguns for their scopes. Its become a large market. Probably ten years ago I couldn't imagine ever using  more than a 3-9x scope on an airgun. Twenty years ago I bet my airguns had 4x scopes.

 

http://www.hawkeopti...m/chairgun.html

 

The lowest mag Hawke SIdewinder 30 goes up to 12x. The Hawke Sidewinders, Panoramas, and others are real popular on the airguns in the US.

 

http://www.hawkeopti...side-focus.html



#6 Brant

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Posted 17 March 2013 - 09:18 AM

Here is the Hawke Sidewinder 30 8-32x56 with the new SR Pro Reticle at 32x on a 70 yard image. Although I prefer the 1/2 mil dot 20x reticle the both glass etched reticles are impressive.

 

Hawkebj32x_zpsf19fe885.jpg



#7 CBR400RR

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Posted 17 March 2013 - 09:37 AM

Is it designed for air rifles? different dynamics and all. And the crickets look cool - but are they 500yard+ guns? 32x? seriously? 9x is a ton of magnification under 100 yards. If you can print patterns with that under 100 yards, more scope is not going to help. 

There are airguns that can shoot dime size groups at 100 yards and here is a video of a guy shooting soda cans at 1/4th mile.

 

 



#8 eeler1

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Posted 17 March 2013 - 09:25 PM

I've got 2 sidewinder tactical scopes, neither one is current production.  I use them for pistol FT (4x12) and rifle FT (6x20? going on memory here).  Love the reticle choice and the mil-dots.   Both work fine for distances out to 55 yards, which is generally what you find in FT matches.  If I were going longer distances, I might opt for the Bushnell Elite (pricey) series of scopes, just better optics and clarity.  But if you need to rangefind, and shoot within maybe 60 yards like most airguns do, the Hawke is a good value.  I'm very happy with mine.

 

The software that comes with some Hawke models is better than nothing, but make sure you test it at the range before you rely on it in the field.

 

Bottom line, the Hawke sidewinder scopes are pretty good for the money.  If you are serious about shooting longer ranges, like 60+ yards, you need to get serious about spending some money.



#9 Brant

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Posted 18 March 2013 - 02:48 PM

Thanks for the info. I also own a Bushnell Elite and have a story to share but to be fair one first needs to compare the more recently redesigned Hawke SIdewinders to the Bushnell Elites and you will find the optics a lot closer. The Tacticals were redesigned about 2-3 years back and the SR 30s in just the last year. Lots of things changed with the lens manufacturing such as the reticle thickness, etc. I only started buying the Tacticals after the redeisgn and would not have considered a SR 30 until this last year. We actually did some informal clarity and brightness testing between a new Sidewinder Tactical 6.5-20x42, a Bushnell Elite 6-24x40, and my NightForce NSF 8-32x56 about two years ago at 20x. Basically the new Hawke was very close to the Elite on clarity but slightly dimmer in low light. Hawke has nearly caught up.

 

Anyway, my story is that my Elite starting losing POI and it took me nearly 4 months and 2 trips back to Bushnell and lots of negotiating to get them to replace the scope.  I fought for so long for such an expensive scope that I decided I was done with Bushnell for a while with their poor customer service in the US (I hear it is better in Europe). I overcranked my elevation on one of my 4 Hawke Tactical SW 6.5-20s and they replaced it in 3 days no questions asked. The scope still worked fine but it put a few very tiny specs of dirt on the reticle.

 

I just let someone compare my Hawke SWT to my Nightforce NSF and they were surprised how little difference there actually is at 20x. They preferred the glass etched reticle on the Hawke. I posted some independent research done comparing high end scopes on this forum a few years back and it was amazing how much snake oil is still being sold out there. High-end versions of Bushnell, Leupold, and Nightforce all underperformed the high-end  scopes like Zeiss, Docter, and March somewhat significantly. The tests measured clarity, brightness, and included environmental testing and was done by a lab in Germany. I argued with a few diehards on that for a while but you can't beat the instruments. The conclusion is you aren't necessarily getting a great scope by dumping a bunch of money on it.

 

A guy at my range has a Bushnell Tactical Elite with the G2 reticle and that is a very nice scope but I refuse to pay $2k for a 37 oz scope. I think they hammer forge the tubes. I guess if I ever do FT competition with ranging, etc I might consider something else. As for the regular Bushnell Elites - the old guys slamming the Hawkes at my range get awfully quiet when I plop my gun next to theirs for a scope-off and eveybody gets a look. Then they shift the debate to weight or ranging.



#10 Brant

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 02:18 PM

I shot with a guy today who has a Steyr LG110 HP (.22) with a new Hawke SW 30 8-32X56 scope on it.  He said it focuses down to 10 meters but not a foot less but the latest ones are very good scopes. He shoots Field Target with it and an occasional vermin he says. Nice gun but I like my Cricket better for pesting purposes at 27" long and under 6 lbs before scope.  Other guys at the range told me he normally shoots in the top three at the local matches. He also has a Steyr LP10 177.



#11 Waldo Reed

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Posted 05 October 2013 - 07:46 PM

I have a .25 Hatsan 125 sniper vortex coming. For a scope I'm considering:

 

...CenterPoint Illuminated 4-16x40mm AO Scope ($70 at Walmart)

...Hawke Panorama EV 4-12x, 40mm or 50mm, AO, 1/2 mil dot reticle or map 6a reticle ($200+ at Pyramyd Air)

 

Thoughts?



#12 Brant

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Posted 05 October 2013 - 07:55 PM

I have the Hawke Panorama 4-12x50AO on my Marauder pistol and it is great for that application with a max distance of about 50 yards. Most of my PCP rifles now have Hawke 8-32x56 Sidewinders with the new SR Pro reticle. That reticle stands with the very best for airgunning at long range.



#13 Waldo Reed

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Posted 05 October 2013 - 08:46 PM

Is the extra 10mm worth the extra $20 and is there any cons compared to the 40mm?

 

Which reticle does your Panorama have?

 

There's some info out there on the map 6 reticle, enough that I would avoid it. However, the map 6A is supposed to be ideal for non long range airguns I guess. There's barely any feedback on it and all I read is the 6x zoom must be set in order to use the reticle. Seems extreme to be locked at a zoom in order to use the reticle.

 

The 1/2 mil dot reticle can be used at any zoom but it seems cluttered enough that it may interfere with targeting.



#14 Brant

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Posted 06 October 2013 - 04:44 AM

Objective lens size is a big debate. Basically, the 40mm is just fine and has some advantages like lower weight. less parallax, closer to barrel mounting, etc.. The 50mm does gather a more light (55%) but how much more effective that is given eye limitations is debatable and a higher scope mount may not be desirable. Ok they may look cooler and be a little better in low light depending on mag setting (another debate). :) I like large heavy high magnification scopes loaded with unnecessary features but I shoot mainly off of shooting benches and rests and often at sparrows in low light at 100 yards with an airgun. My PBs are a different matter.

 

The reticle is the 10X glass etched 1/2 mil dot Hawke is famous for. They are a work of art rivaling many scopes well over $1000. The 10x sized reticles are a bit small for some folks. My six other Hawkes either have 20X size 1/2 mil dot reticles and three now have the SR Pro reticle which is absolutely the cat's meow to airgunning. The 20x size are only on the scopes capable of 20x or higher mag.

 

I found out recently in clarity and brightness testing in a camera shop lab in my area the latest Hawke Sidewinders meter out nearly identically to the $700-800 Nikon Monarch 3s  so you save a few hundred bucks+ and have the same warranty as Leupold now but that is a personal decision.



#15 Brant

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Posted 06 October 2013 - 05:23 AM

the new SR Pro reticle. The elevation increments follow a trajectory pattern so you can sight in at say 50 yards at the center and adjust the magnification so you have 10 yard increments between each major elevation line. No need for a cheat sheet with this reticle. Windage marks give you 5 and 10 mph 90 degree wind offsets. Those letters at the bottom mark lengths that give specific measurements at a certain magnification to aid in range finding. I use a Leupold TBR-1000 for the long shots.

 

Hawkebj32x_zpsf19fe885.jpg



#16 Waldo Reed

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Posted 06 October 2013 - 10:54 AM

I like the exterior look of the 50mm objective lens as well; makes a rifle look meaner. However, I'm going to contact Pyramyd Air to find out which would be better for my air rifle and what height mounts it would require.

 

Regarding the reticles, if Turners Outdoorsman carries the Hawke Panorama then I'll compare the 1/2 mil dot and map 6A in person.

 

Thanks!



#17 Waldo Reed

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 03:14 PM

I contacted Hawke Optics. I was told to download the BRC2 program and compare the functionality of the 1/2 mil dot reticle to the Map 6A reticle. Still learning to use the program but so far I found two things I like about the 1/2 mil dot reticle:

  1. Counting down the reticle from the zeroed point, the 1/2 mil dot reticle has a lot more marks to sight the animal with than the map 6A.
  2. The 1/2 mil dot reticle can be used as a poor mans rangefinder. Why the map 6A cannot albeit less accurate I don't know

I decided to go with a 40mm instead of a 50mm objective lens for the following reasons:

  • Cheaper by $20.
  • Dividing the objective lens by the magnification will provide the exit pupil of the scope. The range is 3 to 10mm for the 40mm objective lens and 4 to 12mm for the 50mm objective lens. I read our eyes pupil can open up at most to 7mm (in complete darkness) and by middle age that drops to 5mm. So a scope exit pupil over 5mm is unusable light.
  • Smaller objective lens will allow me to mount the scope lower, closer to the barrel and further into the range of the adjustable cheek piece of the Hatsan 125 sniper.
  • Less weight.


#18 ratassassin

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 04:56 PM

I like 40-42mm objectives better than 50mm objectives. 



#19 CBR400RR

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 05:06 PM

The higher X magnification you get makes ranging without a range finder a lot easier as a target will go in and out of focus with a lot less turn of the wheel so it's easier to guess the correct range. I saw a guy post videos on the yellow forum where he was shooting soda cans at 600 and 700 yards with an airgun, crazy. 



#20 Brant

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 05:17 PM

Here is a 8-32x56mm SR Pro behemoth without even the sunshade on a 27" Cricket. :blink:

 

 

20130618_183519_zpsa591978c.jpg

20130620_174822_zps7afa21dd.jpg



#21 dwalk

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Posted 05 November 2013 - 09:11 AM

Is it designed for air rifles? different dynamics and all. And the crickets look cool - but are they 500yard+ guns? 32x? seriously? 9x is a ton of magnification under 100 yards. If you can print patterns with that under 100 yards, more scope is not going to help. 

 

i run an 8-32 Barska SWAT on my AF Talon with results that are really astounding to me... :good:






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