52 replies to this topic

[Bisley]

So because the DFG Officer feels that the laws SJ quoted earlier about "Under Penal Code Section 12031 (g) a firearm is consider loaded when there is a live round of ammunition “…in, or attached in ANY MANNER to, the firearm” he's an A-hole, but simply because the CHP was ignorant of this law, he is your buddy? Guess a lot of us on here must be a-holes since we know our jobs and its rules very well, no???

[jawbreaker]

No that's not why he's an a hole and if you didn't always have that I'm the all mighty attitude I might take the time to explain the whole story but honestly it's just not worth it, just keep thinking the way you do no problem, one day you might just have a run in like ours and your mind will be changed. Until then, have fun .

[peeker seeker]

NICE DOG. way to go .. Looks allot better then most around hear..... You can read a law and fifty lawyers will read it fifty different way's.. And if tim is picked up in blue, I do not think if he had a bow at the time would really matter .. Again verry nice yote.

[OrneryOlMofo357]

No that's not why he's an a hole and if you didn't always have that I'm the all mighty attitude I might take the time to explain the whole story but honestly it's just not worth it, just keep thinking the way you do no problem, one day you might just have a run in like ours and your mind will be changed. Until then, have fun .

This is just My way of thinking.. wether its a Re-loading or a hunting mistake any info given could help a prospective shooter. Information can really help others, and actual experience trumps everything. Sharing successes and failures is a win win for everyone. If you feel like your experience with the wrong LEO could help others from ending up in the same situation could help others it might be good to share it. If not thats ok too. I just think that helping others by sharing our mistakes shortens the learning curve. This is not a slam by any means, but if sharing can help others it may be worth it.

[Bisley]

I have had run-ins, even cited before. Difference being I will not belittle the Officer for knowing their job nor for enforcing it. And thank you, I do try to hold myself to a higher standard than most. And will also say this, we were told we were going to hear "the rest of your story" long ago, but to no avail. One can not help but wonder why.................

[jawbreaker]

Because it just got resolved a few weeks ago and I haven't been in a hurry to post it up. I will post it soon.

[BCF]

Good job man! Definitely a nice looking coyote and rifle.

I have removable mags in my rifles. I keep the mags loaded, and IN the rifle. No round in the chamber. According to law, the way I read it, this is clearly legal. However, if I was to get pulled over, I would just reach back and drop the mags to play it safe.

I have a short little 16" bolt gun that I keep in the truck in this condition right next to me when road hunting. All I have to do is cycle the bolt and I'm in action. Anything slower than that and I would miss many chances. When road hunting, the game is already spooked so you can't lose any time. That's my take on it.

As for handguns, if I'm out in the desert offroading (and want to carry a sidearm), my handgun is on my side in the truck or out of the truck. Loaded, no round in the chamber. I'm in the pursuit of hunting and I can have my gun on me. If I go on a main road, I just pull the magazine and stick in the lockbox in my truck.

These damn laws are ridiculous and meant to be confusing. I have a good 2nd amendment lawyer, and I recommend everyone at least contact one and tell him "You're my lawyer." It doesn't cost you anything, and you can say you have a lawyer. He'll give you a card, and if you get pulled over, you don't say a word- you call him.

[OrneryOlMofo357]

BCF, I cant agree with this statement " I have removable mags in my rifles. I keep the mags loaded, and IN the rifle. No round in the chamber. According to law, the way I read it, this is clearly legal. However, if I was to get pulled over, I would just reach back and drop the mags to play it safe."

That is encouraging folks to break the law in My opinion. Even a quick look at CalGuns tells you that when transporting a rifle on public lands, roads highways etc. tells you that a rifle maybe carried in the vehicle, and Yes you can have loaded Mags, but they cannot be inserted in the Rifle. Maybe you have read laws that refute this? And if so please post them for other Members to read. There are lots of new Gun owners that stumble upon this site, and I think its up to us members to provide them with actual laws that will help keep them out of trouble. For as long as I can remember, a Mag always has to be removed while road hunting or traveling on any public land or roadway. If you have rules to the contrary, please feel free to share them with us.

[Frank]

YIKES... I had to go back and see what this thread was originally about.

I personally do not understand what all the fuss is about on loaded firearms in the vehicle. If one NEVER has a loaded firearm (empty chamber & magazine) in a vehicle, no matter where they are or what they are doing, then problem solved. Also, if one is transporting such UN-loaded firearm in a secured box with the ammo separate from the weapon, then problem solved.

So then, WHY would anyone want to temp fate, doing anything otherwise... unless it is to temp fate &/or want a confrontation?!

I am too busy trying to relax, enjoy my sport & nature, without deliberately adding unnecessary risk &/or easily avoidable harm to myself & thus chance a perfect & limited time outdoors. But again, this just may be too much logic... for some?!

[OrneryOlMofo357]

Frank, I have a call into DFG and hope to get an answer back as to what makes a "Loaded Firearm" It would be nice to have it in print so that there are no misunderstandings. DOJ and F&G seem to have different rules? Im supposed to get a call or an E-mail. It would be interesting to get it from the Horese Mouth so to speak. lol

[Frank]

Yes it will, Grant.... Look forward to your post on that.

And you're right... Different agencies have different rules, including cities, county, state, monuments, parks etc & is confusing & absurd of course. That's why I like "empty, separate & cased", as I mentioned above. Works everywhere for everyone & is safe to boot.

[Mutt]

I was coming back from a shooting range in merced and got pulled over by the chp. He saw the locked pistol case on my seat and about came unglued on me. I handed him the key so he could look in it had my stainless 686 with pachis and magnaported in there empty and 2 empty speed loaders.. no loaded shells in the truck anywheres but a can with some empty brass in the bed. I got arrested and gun confiscated and charged with carry a loaded and concealed weapon. This was in 86. I ended up losing the weapon surrenderd to the court and paid a 1k fine. Got a lecture on how I need to learn the rules of carrying a gun. Never knew that a empy speed loader in the same case of the gun was concidered loaded. Needless to say I got taken to the cleaners over it so I do not carry any ammo in a holser and belt with loops nor on a stock with one of them ammo holders. When done shooting they are in different ares and I even go as far as to remove the cylinder on a revolver.

[OrneryOlMofo357]

Well, I got the call.... and Dirty Dave and BCF are correct as far as the F&G law goes. The Lt. I talked to said if the action is open and no unspent round in the chamber it is legal to have bullets in the Magazine. even a blind mag. " I stand corrected, and want to state that right up front to those I doubted. " However this is where it gets sticky... say you are hunting on lands that cross paved roads, or areas that you want to hunt require you to travel down the paved road to a different hunting spot. Once you get on the paved prtion of the road "according to the Lt. I talked to" if a Sherriff, local police, CHP etc pulls you over, they can use the DOJ laws against you. So while having rounds in and around and On your rifle while hunting on dirt roards may not get you into trouble one must be careful while on paved roads. So there you have it from DFG. A loaded weapon by DFG standards is one in the chamber, but bullets in the Magazine is OK..

Very interesting story Mutt. I thought tha part about while hunting and going to and from the Range or a Gunsmith would be some protection. But apparently maybe not?

[Bisley]

YIKES... I had to go back and see what this thread was originally about.

I personally do not understand what all the fuss is about on loaded firearms in the vehicle. If one NEVER has a loaded firearm (empty chamber & magazine) in a vehicle, no matter where they are or what they are doing, then problem solved. Also, if one is transporting such UN-loaded firearm in a secured box with the ammo separate from the weapon, then problem solved.

So then, WHY would anyone want to temp fate, doing anything otherwise... unless it is to temp fate &/or want a confrontation?!

I am too busy trying to relax, enjoy my sport & nature, without deliberately adding unnecessary risk &/or easily avoidable harm to myself & thus chance a perfect & limited time outdoors. But again, this just may be too much logic... for some?!

You mean like why we will spend 15-30 minutes trying to stay perfectly still on a stand, but bitch, moan, and com[lain about the 15-45 seconds it takes to empty a rifle or even a rifle and 10 rounds in a buttstock holder? By the time you finish reading this sentence alone, you could have completely cleared and emptied your gun and all extra rounds! So I personally don't know which is sillier, not doing it, or complaining about it all the time?

[Mutt]

In this state you have no protection from things like that better to not take a chance then to take it.

[KNOCKED UP]

What happened to my constitutional 2nd amendment rights?
Maybe it really is like Michelle Obama said on a talk show today.
"we are a democracy", someone needs to tell her, this is not a democracy, but a republic.
Tom

[KNOCKED UP]

Good job man! Definitely a nice looking coyote and rifle.

I have removable mags in my rifles. I keep the mags loaded, and IN the rifle. No round in the chamber. According to law, the way I read it, this is clearly legal. However, if I was to get pulled over, I would just reach back and drop the mags to play it safe.

I have a short little 16" bolt gun that I keep in the truck in this condition right next to me when road hunting. All I have to do is cycle the bolt and I'm in action. Anything slower than that and I would miss many chances. When road hunting, the game is already spooked so you can't lose any time. That's my take on it.

As for handguns, if I'm out in the desert offroading (and want to carry a sidearm), my handgun is on my side in the truck or out of the truck. Loaded, no round in the chamber. I'm in the pursuit of hunting and I can have my gun on me. If I go on a main road, I just pull the magazine and stick in the lockbox in my truck.

These damn laws are ridiculous and meant to be confusing. I have a good 2nd amendment lawyer, and I recommend everyone at least contact one and tell him "You're my lawyer." It doesn't cost you anything, and you can say you have a lawyer. He'll give you a card, and if you get pulled over, you don't say a word- you call him.

BCF,
I am not here to judge anyone, but road hunting is illegal.
Not to mention, that is not what hunting is all about.
Also shooting from the road is not legal either.
I can understand having problems with some cop that thinks he is John Wayne, but why give him
any reason to arrest you in the first place.
If you leave your guns unloaded in the truck, MOST law enforcement wouldn't push the issue.
I still have a hard time with the part that says you need to have it in a locked box in the trunk.
In conclusion, Keep your guns unloaded in your truck, and get out of your vehicle to hunt.
and the law probably will not bother you.
people that keep running up and down the road are making it harder for the guys that are sitting at the top of
the mountain, trying to be silent.
Tom

[Frank]

Well said, Bob, Mutt & Tom... And why I never understand why this topic even comes up at all, much less repeatedly as it does.

This ain't Arizona, Texas, Wyoming or Montana or some other REAL AMERICAN state... This is Nazifornia unfortunately, & where hunters make up less than 2/3 rds of 1% of the population. We ARE the problem in other words... in their eyes! (whoever their is?).

So take an (unnecessary, maybe legal) chance if you like... Custer did! (uh, anyone under 50 may have to look that up. LOL)

[Shoot-it]

Road hunting is not illegal people do it from the forestry roads not public roads.Yes you have to get out of the truck and shoot that's where that dfg law comes from where your rifle can be loaded with out a round in the chamber.
Handguns are the ones that need to be locked up.If your going hunting you can have your rifle up front with you or in the back seat.

[jawbreaker]

When I was researching this after my run in I read that a long gun needs to be transported in a locked case if you are within a certain distance from a school and I know most of us drive by schools on our way to go hunting. And if you are driving through a state park your gun has to be in operable acording to the state rangers I have talked to,but they also said they probably wouldn't hassle me if the guns wrer in there cases. The bottom line is you don't know what the LEO will site you for only that particular officer does, wether it is right or wrong once you are sited it's your responsability to proove yourself inocent and that alone can get expensive. I will post our incodent in a few minutes.

[ShooterJohn]

Road hunting is not illegal people do it from the forestry roads not public roads.Yes you have to get out of the truck and shoot that's where that dfg law comes from where your rifle can be loaded with out a round in the chamber.
Handguns are the ones that need to be locked up.If your going hunting you can have your rifle up front with you or in the back seat.

You still have to be off of the roadway even a dirt road. Any road traversed by the public is a public road and all laws apply John.

[BCF]

I have removable magazines in all my rifles. I keep the magazines loaded and IN the rifle. No round in the chamber. This is when road hunting. If I got pulled over, I'd probably drop the mags just to play it safe, but according to the law, I don't have to.

Nice Coyote!

[ShooterJohn]

BCF, you can easily get yourself shot even touching a gun when you are being stopped, your choice of course. So you are saying according to the law you don't need to drop the mags so why would you?